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Herne Bay, England, CT6
United Kingdom

Community website for all things Herne Bay (Kent, UK). Covers: The Downs, Herne Bay Museum, Herne Bay Historical Records Society, Herne Bay Pier Trust, Herne Bay in Bloom, East Cliff Neighbourhood Panel, No Night Flights, Manston Airport, Save Hillborough, Kitewood, WEA, Local Plan and much, much more...

Friends of the Downs

Good cop, bad cop.

HBM

A rather odd sensation that I don't think I'll ever get the hang of is banging my head against one part of the Council, whilst having a sensible conversation with another part. Hey ho.

CCC chants the mantra that registration (of the Downs as a village green) would prevent maintenance, presumably in the hope that an oft-repeated lie will somehow become true. In their objection to Kent County Council (the village green registration authority), they invoke a 135 year old, late Victorian Act of parliament to support their claim that it is actually impossible for the Downs to become a village green. Balderdash, as the late Victorians would have said.

Meanwhile, the Outdoor Leisure department has recognised The Downs is a "strategic open space", being the only large open space in town apart from the Memorial Gardens. They are also keen to work with local "grassroots" groups, not least because such groups have access to sources of funding that are closed to the Council.

This has lead to an awakening of the idea of active co-operation:

Thank you for taking the time to chat through some joint working opportunities to enhance the Downs as we are keen to work with community groups. As you are aware the primary function of the Downs is coastal protection that may, from time to time, have to take precedence. However, we have already set aside some funding for some environmental enhancement for this strategically important piece of open space.

The aim of joint working would be to develop a management plan based upon survey work, community and partnership input and this could include issues such as: amend habitat - depending on the results of wildlife surveys, improved access, promotion / awareness, training for community volunteers or guided walks and much more no doubt. We see key partners such as yourselves, Kent Wildlife Trust, Herne Bay in Bloom, Natural England and many others will emerge.

The contrast between their stubbornness over registration and their enthusiasm for "joint working opportunities" is stark. Registration would cost them potential revenues from developers, whereas working with community groups can magic money out of thin air. Is that really all there is to it?


Friends of the Downs home page

More maintenance nonsense

HBM

Wholly wrong!

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More tosh from the Council, I'm sorry to say. A local councillor is reported as saying that village green status would delay emergency repair work on The Downs. This is STILL nonsense, merely a cover story that is getting flimsier by the day. The sharper-eyed amongst you will notice that the picture clearly shows a ladder running down to the bottom of the hole. Obviously this is not an accidental, natural hole - as Council spokesman Rob Davies says it's "part of the slope drainage system". Mr Davies also points out that "the responsibility to repair these lies with the City Council".

The Council neglected its responsibility to inspect and maintain this part of the drainage system. The manhole cover became overgrown, disintegrated and fell down the hole - the remains appear to be at the bottom of the ladder in the picture. The soil that once covered the manhole wore thin, and hey presto - suddenly there's a deep and dangerous hole in the ground.

This hazard is entirely due to the Council's neglect. Read on.


Foot-long crater opens up to reveal drop of 10 feet

HBG 2010-06-03 The Hole.jpg

A dog almost fell 10ft into water after a mysterious hole appeared on the Downs at Herne Bay. Authorities were alerted after the foot-long crater believed to be an old manhole was discovered less than a metre from a public footpath on Saturday morning.

Surrounded by loose earth, the pitch dark hole was mistaken for a rabbit hole by an eager Jack Russell. But only the quick-thinking actions of its owner, who grabbed the pooch as he went to dive into the hole, saved a potential tragedy. Bay councillor Vince McMahan, called by the owner and first on the scene with foreshore ramp attendant Doug Arponen, says a small child could have drowned:

“My two-year-old grandson Connor would have stood no chance if he'd fallen down there. It wouldn’t matter how quick the fire services arrived. I wouldn't be able to get down there myself and would be helpless. It`s really quite frightening. Small kids love to walk along the ledge of the footpath, and this hole was probably just a foot away. If someone had slipped and fell down the hole it would have been a disaster”

Mr Arponen and Cllr McMahan alerted the city council and waited by the hole for three hours until Serco arrived at 12.30pm. Workers covered the hole with a sheet of wood and returned later to fence the area off. Mr Arponen said:

“There's no way it could have been left as it was. You could tell it had probably been like it for some time as well, because the edge wasn't neat and the grass had grown. When I saw it I thought it was best to stick around. After all, the number one priority is public safety"

Cllr McMahan says the discovery of the hole adds weight to the argument against granting the Downs Village Green Status:

“If the status was awarded we would have to ask the Secretary of State to carry out emergency maintenance work like this. That takes time and money and could well have been too late in this instance.”

City council spokesman Rob Davies said:

“They are part of slope drainage system. We were alerted to this problem on Saturday and on-call staff attended to inspect the site. The hole was covered over and fencing was put up around it, as well as a second manhole cover further along the Downs, to make them safe. The responsibility to repair these lies with the city council, because they are part of the slope drainage system. An order for this work to be carried out has already been placed and we will inspect other covers on the East Cliff in case of further problems."

HB Gazette 3rd Jun 2010


Friends of the Downs home page

Information Panel sites

HBM

Just in from Canterbury Galactic HQ: this is where they're thinking of putting the new information panels on The Downs...

Rosemary Selling writes:

The signs will be constructed of semi-seasoned oak (FSC certified) with grp panels incorporating the sealing of the finalised artwork in a clear fibre-glass panel. These panels offer weather protection & are uv resistant. Graffiti can be cleaned off (usually the cleaning agents used do not affect the panel beneath). The panels come with tamper resistant fixings. Slight scratches can be infilled with clear varnish. They will be lectern style to complement the views of the coastline. Hopefully the designs too, are sympathetic.

Of course nothing is completely vandal proof but the company we are using has installed many panels in Kent and Medway.  In cases of vandalism or damage we would look at repairs/remedial actions/replacement.

With regards to their locations please see plans attached these show the preferred locations of the Herne Bay in Bloom committee and are positioned to avoid the engineering structures that are in place as you known all over The Downs (and beyond!). It would be helpful if you could you let me know comments by Tues lunchtime.

Panel sites.jpg
  • Heritage: opposite Hilltop Road.
  • Orientation: eastern end of Beacon Hill, towards the Hundred Steps
  • Wildlife: next to the George & Mary seat on The Lees

Friends of the Downs home page

The point is: CCC already maintains village greens...

HBM

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As you may know, one of our councillors recently resurrected the claim that village green status would somehow complicate, impede or prevent maintenance work being carried out on The Downs. I had already sent a letter to the Council's Legal department (in January 2010) that explained why this was not the case, but this message seems not to have filtered through to all the councillors. So I sent them all a copy of the letter that I had sent to Legal, just to make sure that they're up to date.

Cllr Vickery-Jones then sent all the councillors a message saying: "We are awaiting advice from our own legal department, it would be prudent not to form a view based on hearsay evidence before that advice is forthcoming." Here I share with you, dear reader, my next salvo:

I have no wish to weary you with this email exchange, and hope that the following simple fact will finally resolve the question of maintenance of village greens:

Canterbury City Council already carries out maintenance work on village greens.

For example, at Whitstable:

  • Within the last couple of years, CCC completely took over the western half of the village green between Island Wall and West Beach (VG 115) for a period of months, using it for timber storage and erecting a row of portacabins as offices for the workers.
  • Similarly on the village green at Seasalter/West Beach (VG 126), the Council erected sea defences and brought in large quantities of shingle. CCC received no objections from the “inhabitants of the locality” to this work, because it was clearly in their interest, as would be any maintenance works on The Downs at Herne Bay.

The legal position requires no clarification. This is not hearsay, it is fact: village green status is no obstacle to the Council carrying out maintenance work.

Is that conclusive? Will it suffice? Stay tuned...


Friends of the Downs home page

Council 'is not right on Downs'

HBM

The Council says that village green status would block maintenance work on The Downs - this is nonsense.


Preservation body pans decision

GIF wrong.GIF

Campaigners have hit back at council plans to block protection for a town beauty spot. Our exclusive story last week revealed that officials were considering an application to register the Downs, at Beacon Hill, as a village green to protect it from development. But Canterbury City Council bosses are planning to oppose the scheme, lodged by the Save Our Downs campaign, because they maintain it would block vital maintenance work. Campaign co-ordinator Phil Rose said he had information to the contrary. He said:

"The council first raised this concern with us in December 2009. The campaign team immediately spoke to the Open Spaces Society who are experts on the subject. We spoke to Kent County Council’s village greens registration team. We spoke to the legal advisors at the Secretary of State’s department. We did some legal research with the Planning Inspectorate. They all agreed that there is no problem. The upshot of all our research is that the council's fears are groundless. Legally if the maintenance work is 'with a view to the better enjoyment' of the village green, then the council can do that work without seeking permission."

Mr Rose, of Beacon Hill, said maintenance work to protect the area would be included as work for the "better enjoyment" of the area. He added:

"My house is on the edge of the Downs - I have no interest in stopping the council from doing any maintenance work. There’s even a legal option for the council to give itself advance permission for specific works like drainage, raising, levelling or preventing accidents. This should be enough to put everyone’s mind at rest."

He is encouraging people to contact Canterbury City Council chief executive Colin Carmichael to urge him to back the application.

HB Times 15th Apr 2010


Friends of the Downs home page


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