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Herne Bay, England, CT6
United Kingdom

Community website for all things Herne Bay (Kent, UK). Covers: The Downs, Herne Bay Museum, Herne Bay Historical Records Society, Herne Bay Pier Trust, Herne Bay in Bloom, East Cliff Neighbourhood Panel, No Night Flights, Manston Airport, Save Hillborough, Kitewood, WEA, Local Plan and much, much more...

No Night Flights

Filtering by Tag: KLM

KLM - everything's going to be fine. Really.

HBM

I flew from Manston to Schipol a couple of weeks after the service started. On the 10am flight, not the 6:30am NIGHT FLIGHT, naturally. 

The charming staff told me that the first couple of days had been "mad busy", with VIPs and bigwigs jetting back and forth - on free tickets presumably - but things had quietened down since then.

There were 16 passengers on my flight on the way out, 12 on the way back. And, yes, I do realise that one trip is no more than a snapshot and may not be representative.

It's an uncrowded, quick and convenient journey, but clearly not sustainable if the planes are flying less than a quarter full. I'll let you know what it's like the next time I go - I hope to make the most of this route before KLM pulls the plug. My guess is that KLM will tough it out for the summer season, suspend it for the winter, and then simply not restart.


Charles Buchanan

Charles Buchanan

Manston Airport bosses confident of KLM future

Bosses at Manston Airport have said they are confident that a new passenger service to Amsterdam has a future. It comes after passengers said they had travelled on KLM planes that were less than half full.

The Dutch carrier started twice-daily flights from East Kent to Schiphol three months ago. Charles Buchanan, Manston's chief executive, told the BBC that the new service was a success:

"We have some flights that are less full than others obviously, but we've had others that are absolutely jam-packed and not a spare seat to be had. That's the normal way of aviation - you get some that are full and some that are less so. We're confident that the service has a future. This is a growing service, the forward bookings are coming in at a good rate."

KLM started running two morning flights from Manston, with one returning in mid-morning and the other in the evening, starting on 2 April.

BBC 1st Jul 2013


No Night Flights home page

Why throw good money at bad airport?

HBM

logo Visit Kent.png

In the hope of finding why KCC are peeing our money away, we've asked Sharon Dawson (top banana at Visit Kent) some simple and obvious questions. We'll let you know what, if anything, comes of them.


Dear Ms Dawson,

I understand that Visit Kent has been given £100,000 of public money in order to 'market' KLM flights at Manston.  My understanding is that you believe that this money is to enable you to bring visitors into the county as tourists to the county in order to spend money in the county.

I would be grateful if you could answer some questions.

1. What research have KCC or Visit Kent done in terms of revenue brought specifically into a county that has a regional airport? The research I have undertaken shows that regional airports are exporters of tourists to a very significant degree and that even those visitors they do attract  tend to head straight for major tourist centres, most notably London, Edinburgh, Glasgow etc. could you provide me with some concrete evidence that you have that shows significant revenue streams from incoming tourists at comparable regional airports?  I am assuming that such research must be available or such a significant sum of money would not have been committed to a privately owned operation?

2. Exactly how is this money to be spent and where? Given the aim is to attract foreign visitors - which countries/cities/areas are to be targeted and on what basis? I would like confirmation that no money is to be spent advertising outward bound routes given that simply takes money OUT the county. The UK's tourism deficit is already greater than in any other country so it hardly benefits our ailing economy, both local and national to spend public money on persuading people to spend their money abroad.

I look forward to hearing from you.


No Night Flights home page

Council throws good money at bad airport

HBM

logo KCC.png

KCC + KLM + KIA = WTF

Getting a straight answer out of KCC is hard at the best of times - even with the legal leverage of the Freedom of Information Act it can take months. But it's usually worth the wait, and the dogged persistence is rewarded. And let's not forget, anything that's released under the FoI Act is stuff that they should have told you in the first place. By definition.

A man of Kent, showing the finest British bulldog determination and tenacity set about finding out if there are any hidden deals behind the recently announced KLM-Manston story. Eventually, he managed to prise these three sentences out of them:

I can confirm Kent County Council has not been asked for any contributions from KLM nor have we been asked to fund KLM.
We were however, asked by the owners of Manston airport if we would contribute to a marketing package to market both the route and the opportunities in Kent.
We have agreed a contribution of up to £100,000 subject to approval of a marketing plan and for the monies to be managed by Visit Kent.

Regular readers will remember that KCC and Infratil colluded in a bid to central Government which included a generous £600k sweetener for KLM - effectively "we'll pay you to use this airport". They were turned down, quite rightly.

We'll probably never know whether KLM had put pressure on them to cross their palm with silver, or whether KCC and Infratil are simply very generous (with other people's money), but it's depressingly unsurprising to find that they're at it again.

Everyone knows Infratil is selling Manston airport. More accurately, Infratil is trying to sell Manston airport - it's been on the market since March 2012, and the asking price seems to be sinking to the same level as airport-free agricultural land. Despite this, they have the balls to ask KCC for money to market and promote the highest profile route they've got (even though it isn't even running yet). KCC, unspeakable idiots that they are, agreed!

For reasons best known to KCC - but I suspect connected to EU competition regulations - they will be "laundering" the money through Visit Kent. So Kent County Council is happy to use public money to market a French/Dutch airline flying from a New Zealand-owned airport. And, yes, this is the same KCC that's cutting funding to things that people care about.

What makes KCC think this will be money well spent? And what exactly are Visit Kent going to be doing? Good questions, which we have asked on your behalf.


No Night Flights home page

Game-changer - Manston to stop being an airport

HBM

logo Infratil Manston.jpg

Manston and Prestwick have proved hard to sell. Unsurprisingly. Infratil wants to sell them because they're failures - and that's why they're hard to sell.

Infratil has been losing millions every year, for years, and they're eager to staunch the flow. The penny seems to have dropped that these two failed airports would be easier to sell... if they weren't airports.

So Infratil is putting the word out that they're prepared to stump up cash to help potential buyers transform the airports into, er, something they actually want to buy.

Do feel free to use the comments section to pass on any helpful suggestions for Manton's future... theme park... solar farm... race track... nature reserve...


Infratil says it would consider investing in its two British airports to change their functions to help make them more attractive to sell.

The listed infrastructure investor's Glasgow Prestwick and Kent airports are for sale after years of under-performance. Last week, Dutch national carrier KLM confirmed it would start making twice daily flights from the Kent airport to Amsterdam from April 2013.

Infratil executive Tim Brown says the process of selling the airports has taken longer than the company expected. He says the company now has to look at a range of complex proposals and if the use of an airport is going to change, it will have ramifications for local communities.

Mr Brown says if airports are very successful then councils or cities often then tax them, but if they are struggling they may then either need subsidies or be closed and put to alternative use. He says the debate then becomes more complicated, which makes timeframes more difficult to guess. Mr Brown would neither confirm or deny whether Infratil is looking to buy Stanstead Airport in London.

Copyright © 2012, Radio New Zealand 19 November 2012


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KLM-Manston: analysis

HBM

Regular readers will recall that the last time KLM showed any interest in Manston, they were being lured by the promise of £600,000 - money which Manston and KCC were trying to prise out of the Government's Regional Growth Fund. The Government said "No", and KLM faded into the background. I do hope this new service isn't being subsidised from the public purse (national, county or district).

Read More
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All aboard the 4.20am flight to Amsterdam?

HBM

smiley tired.png

Let's have a quick look at the latest exciting news to come from Manston airport. The suggestion is that KLM's decision as whether or not to run a twice a day service between Manton and Schipol will be influenced (but not decided) by the response to Manston's online survey.

  • Charles Buchanan says that KLM would have a plane parked at Manston overnight, ready to fly to Schipol each morning.
  • Charles Buchanan has often said that planes only make money when they are in the air, so it follows that KLM would want their "Manston" plane back in Schipol bright and early so that it has plenty of working (flying) hours ahead of it through the rest of the day.
  • Schipol Airport is effectively closed between 10pm and 6am, and Amsterdam is one hour ahead of us (at the moment).
  • The flight time from Manston to Schipol would be about 40 minutes.
  • To arrive in Schipol at 6am (local time), KLM's "Manston" plane would have to leave at 4.20am (local time).
  • The online questionnaire doesn't ask what time of day people would like to fly - now you know why.
  • The online questionnaire doesn't ask how much people would be prepared to pay for their flight.

As influential local commentator Maurice Byford has pointed out:

Any business worth its salt would carry out due diligence, population and traffic analysis and SWOT analysis without resorting to a survey. You might want to ask, how many people travel to Europe from Kent, but then you need only look at the traffic figures from EuroStar train from to see the passenger footfall for Belgium.

There are plenty of reputable consultancies that specialise in providing detailed economic and demographic analyses to help businesses make rational commercial decisions. They have access to all the available data on business activities, income distribution and socio-economic groupings by post code. They have a pretty good idea how many people run businesses with European interests, and how many people are likely to take weekend jaunts to the Continent or connect to long-haul flights.

It is very likely that KLM have already done their homework, which is why they were looking for £600,000 of public money to underwrite the risk of operating from Manston. The online survey doesn't cover two of the questions that KLM most clearly need answered - how much will people pay, and how willing are they to accept KLM's offering (i.e. first thing and last thing, and nothing in between).

Airlines are high investment, high throughput, low margin businesses. They employ people full-time to examine every available business opportunity, and re-examine each option every couple of years. All of the major airlines will have examined and re-examined Manston over the years it has been owned by Infratil. With the exception of FlyBe's tentative experiment with a couple of minor routes (which failed for lack of passengers), there have been no takers.

KLM's interest in Manston may simply be that it is cheaper to park a plane there than at Schipol, and there's the possibility that the passenger fares would exceed the fuel costs to Schipol. In all probability, KLM will discover what others have discovered before them - Manston's catchment area cannot support a successful passenger or freight airport. It doesn't matter how keen the local residents or the local businesses are - there simple aren't enough of them.

After years of fanciful forecasts, missed targets and false hopes, this may be Infratil's legacy - a minimal passenger service that only ever flies at night, while the airport is almost entirely idle through the 16 hours of daytime. This is Infratil waving goodbye, with two fingers.


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